The X-Men TAS Podcast: Strange Land, Savage Heart

The great Colossus and Nightcrawler step into the spotlight reminding us all what great characters they are while more characters unceremoniously get killed on the latest episode of X-Men (97) TAS! Join us as we discuss...

• Some belated thoughts on Masters of the Universe and Supergirl movies!
• Reminiscing about the New Mutants movie mainly because this episode put Anja Taylor Joy's Magik back into our minds!
• Colossus finally joins the team after all these years???
• Hoping the X-Men find Gambit totally normal reading a magazine back in his X-Mansion apartment!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:01

Welcome to the X-Men Task Podcast. My name is Willie Simpson.

SPEAKER_01 0:04

My name is Sonia Rappaport, and today our special co-host is returning Feliciano Flores. Welcome back to the show. Thanks for having me. Yay!

SPEAKER_03 0:14

Feliciano, it's so great to have you back. Um we're here for the seventh episode of X-Men 97 Season 2, Strangeland Savage Heart, which is a play on an episode from the original series, which I think might have been called Savage Heart, Strangeland. I don't know, or Savage Land, Strange Heart. Whatever. It was some kind of play on the original series. Um briefly before we get into it, uh a whole lot more, I just want to say this is one of the best episodes of season two thus far. Might be my favorite.

SPEAKER_04 0:42

Yeah, I agree. Uh kind of everything that we talked about last week, they did in this episode, including calling back Exodus, who I had just kind of been like, how do you just throw him in the background? I was like, oh, that's why. Because you intend on using him later on. Have faith that we intended to do things, you stupid fat boy.

SPEAKER_03 1:03

Uh um, yeah, the uh this was like a great episode in general. Uh, we're gonna talk all about it. Um, I just want to say real quick, check our show notes for the plugs, especially our Facebook group, which if you want to be part of the special Spider-Man uh reaction podcast movie episode, uh, you have to be part of that group. And uh we hope to do that in a couple of weeks once everyone's seen the movie. And that's going to be that's not gonna be a sort of just group-only interaction. I'm gonna put that in the main podcast feed. So again, if you see Spider-Man, you have thoughts you're dying to get off, uh join that group and uh you could join the Zoom session when the time comes. Um speaking of which, Sonia and I, we got our tickets for Spider-Man for tomorrow. Very exciting. Uh we're going, I guess, opening night. Oh, really, I guess it opens tonight, technically, but the broad general opening is tomorrow, and we'll be jammed into the last row. So we don't have an aisle seat, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_01 2:06

Better than the first row. I don't I don't really mind that. We have a couple other movies that we've watched recently. Flea Santa, sorry, I know you didn't see these. We're just gonna talk about them real quick, get it off our chest. We did see Masters of the Universe. Uh, it was bad.

SPEAKER_03 2:19

Will thought I mean I I thought it had potential. The first 30 to 40 minutes were fun because He-Man is trapped on Earth uh and he's a normal, nice, earnest man. And that's all very interesting. His whole life they set up, but the second he returns to I guess Eternia, I thought it was like profoundly uninteresting. And it looked bad too at the CGI world they construct for him. And it's kind of a shame because I think the script does have like some nice sparkle to it, and the acting performances were very fun and earnest. So I was disappointed that the movie just like lost its grip on me once he becomes He-Man, you know, once he declares that he has the power.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

That was a much better critical review than what I said. I think you're way more tricked out than me. It is true that that like throughout the acting performances were good, and it like seemed like all the actors were really having fun because they're like self-aware about the kind of movie that they're making. So, like that part of it was fun to watch. It just like all the CGI of it and like all the minor characters. I don't know, maybe if I was more familiar with all the minor characters, I would be more into it, but I don't really have a background with Masters of the Universe or He-Man, so it just maybe wasn't for me. Do you plan to see this movie, Feliciano?

SPEAKER_04 3:36

Yeah, I will definitely will. Um, I just go we kind of missed it on the day when our friends went, and with everything with work, it got lost in the shuffle. I was a Masters of the Universe kid. It it was I I won't say it was like top five, but like I enjoy the mythos quite a lot. Uh so I I will be checking it out, especially now that it's like streaming.

SPEAKER_03 3:57

Yeah, as a streaming thing, it I think it's fine. Like, I was not I didn't feel like bad about anything. Uh it was just okay experience.

SPEAKER_01 4:06

I don't feel like I totally wasted my time watching it. I'm a little surprised Thundercats doesn't have like a modern remake yet. I feel like that must be coming.

SPEAKER_04 4:15

Well, so the thing was they did it for they they had the the the last cartoon reboot for it, and they did the same thing with Masters of the Universe, which had a great cartoon reboot recently or continuation. Yeah, like that series was maybe two years ago. That was great. Um, everyone loved it. And then the She Rah cartoon is also also did very well, so that's why they pushed this. So I maybe Thundercats is coming down the line, hopefully. But again, I'm personally rooting for Tiger Sharks. Um for those who don't know, that was the basically ripoff of sp of Thundercats that was about sea creatures. I'd much rather be under the sea.

SPEAKER_03 4:56

Um I'd much rather be at the cats. I was a Thundercats kid, but again, it was I just I feel like both He-Man and Thundercats were just at the very beginning of my childhood, along with Jem and the holograms, which I could never Gem is her name.

SPEAKER_01 5:10

Right. Um Yeah, I also was like just a little too young for them. It it was like few and far between to catch the Thundercats episodes, but it was really exciting if you did see one somehow.

SPEAKER_03 5:22

Yeah, it was one of those shows for me. That's what I put all those shows in that camp of like if I stumbled upon them as a kid magically, I was so excited.

SPEAKER_04 5:30

I remember those and uh what is it? Oh god, uh Voltron. Because I remember Voltron was the first action figure I had. Uh that delightful 80s Voltron action figure that could kill a human being because it was made of pure steel for some reason. Um just whacked someone over the head. You can do it. I've never heard of an action figure made of metal. That's insane. It was like I I I have remnants of it around because it was more like it wasn't it was a brick. It was I couldn't lift it all uh as a kid.

SPEAKER_03 6:05

And yet my brother still somehow managed to break it. Yeah, there's a lot like less toy regulation in the 80s. Um I'm just basing that off of Simpsons jokes where they buy a bunch of toys and they're all dangerous and cause bodily harm. But I'm trying to I mean, as a kid, they also had as a kid in the 80s you could get a toy gun that looked like a real gun. And too many police officers shot children over them. So those had to start being banned and uh enter the nerf era. Um okay, so Masters University. Oh, we also saw Supergirl, which just also got released digitally. Uh I liked it. I I didn't I don't think I'll ever watch it again, but I thought it was good, and it's kind of a shame it bombed. I I I think I think it's a fine movie. I just don't know who the audience for it was in retrospect. That's my biggest takeaway. I thought teenage girls were the target audience, probably, no? I don't know. I mean, it didn't seem like a movie for teenage girls to me. Really? I thought it was like it seemed like Guardians of the Galaxy or like a Star Trek movie. That could be for girls. I know, yeah, but it you know, it was like not aimed in that way, really. It was just a it was a g I wouldn't say it's a generic superhero movie, but it's it's of that oeuvre. It's not like they broke new ground with the way they told the story or the presentation of it.

SPEAKER_01 7:30

No. So I like the alienness of it. That part was fun. I thought it was fun in general. I thought it was gonna be pretty bad. It exceeded my expectations. Uh I also probably won't watch it like a dozen more times, but you know, it was okay.

SPEAKER_04 7:45

You haven't seen this one either, right? I I did not. I've been I I've been a bad geek.

SPEAKER_01 7:50

Um that one to keep up with these.

SPEAKER_04 7:53

Well, both these movies bombed in the box office. So, you know, you're it was also the it's also the thing, and this is a personal thing that I hope I don't offend anyone here. Um Jason Momoa. Uh I have my moments with him. I think they're a thing I loved, I like him as I liked him as Aquaman, but I don't know. Something about I feel like his last couple projects, he's been so campy that in a way that I have not appreciated that like I when they showed that saw the trailer and I saw him as Lobo, I was just like, this is not I'm good. I'll watch this when it's streaming.

SPEAKER_03 8:30

Listen, I a hundred percent agree with you on everything, include up into including the part of like I'm not excited to see Jason Momoa's Lobo. He's a good Lobo in this movie, and I'm not a Lobo fan. I thought he came off well, he was interesting, and he had a nice amount of like humor and menace to him, and he was he was presented well. And I'm just saying, like, I was surprised. Like, I thought Lobo would be the most annoying part of the movie. He was a better part of the film. I actually way more suited to Lobo than Aquaman, personally.

SPEAKER_01 9:02

I am only familiar with Lobo from the Superman cartoon, not the comics, so that probably influences my opinion of the character, but I thought he struck the chord really well between being like a scary loose canon and also like those moments of humor where he like almost befriends Superman kind of. Like I thought it was like riding the line well.

SPEAKER_04 9:26

See, I'm glad you said that because like my problem with the trailer is that he seemed all camp and no menace. So like I'm glad that he has the menace in I'm I'm glad to hear that.

SPEAKER_03 9:36

I mean, I might be imagining the menace a little bit. I don't know. I just I think I just think it was a competent performance and it wasn't distracting. It was he seemed fully uh like he fit in with the world the movie was presenting, this alien world. I think my biggest problem with the Supergirl movie, and I I've really digested this, is you gotta set it on Earth, in my opinion. This movie takes entirely takes place entirely in outer space, and I just think that is a mistake, namely because we've seen a lot of these outer space superhero movies, and I don't like understand why you would present Supergirl as a space alien in this respect. Uh if I was doing the movie, this is my wacky idea. It's it's totally it's probably it's probably not a great idea, but I would have Supergirl fall into like a time portal and wake up in the 1950s, and she's a hero in the 50s when there's just broad misogyny and she's a modern, more modern person, and she's just confronting, she's like both saving the earth for some big threat and also confronting the jackassy of the world. And I think that would have been a fun social commentary, and it also puts Supergirl in an era in which she was invented, which I also think would be fun to like play with those tropes, and I that would have been my crazy take on it.

SPEAKER_04 10:48

I mean, though that's also Wonder Woman, that's kind of and like 19 teens is a little, you know, that's like kind of not as relatable as the 50s, I think. I will say in terms of the idea of setting it in space, the DC verse hasn't really done space. So I guess that's their attempt to be like, oh, this is a broader universe too. Uh come see, but like us too. Us two. But they haven't really given it the breath to do that. And like honestly, Green Lantern is the vehicle if you want to shoot into space. Um, I think from from from the main or or Martian Manhunter, god forbid, you know, the actual alien.

SPEAKER_03 11:32

Um another criticism I have, and uh Feliciano, tell me what you think, Sonya too. Like she's paired up Malian movie with this brand new character who's basically like a 13-year-old girl who, you know, if she's from the comic, she's not a major character. It's not like it's Catwoman, you know. It's just some like alien girl she meets and she tags along with Supergirl throughout the movie. I think they had a character like that in the Harley Quinn movie too, with Margot Roby, wasn't there like a little teenage sidekick? Yeah. So uh if I was doing it too, I would have just gone bigger and teamed her up with like a bigger hero, be it a female hero or just a regular DC hero, you know. Like, I think you probably would have had a hit if the movie was just simply called Supergirl and Wonder Woman. I'm not saying that's like a great idea, but at least you're sort of like hitting two birds with one stone, and you're getting like an interesting pairing that could uh like carve out a little bit of their own identity together. Um, because this was a buddy movie, but she's buddied with someone who's like anonymous, and it's not it's also it's not super girl and lobo. Loba's in the movie for like less than 10 minutes.

SPEAKER_01 12:41

He's a side character for sure, yeah. This 13-year-old girl is more like the second star of the movie. Are you gonna see it? Can I spoil it? Uh yeah, go ahead. Go ahead. It's fine.

unknown 12:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 12:52

I am gonna see it, but like I'm gonna spoil it. I think like the 13-year-old girl was not a good choice for different reasons than what you're saying. Well, it's like, so I hate the main plot point of the ending so much. The girl, her whole family is killed by the villain and she swears revenge. And she's chasing down this guy, but she doesn't really have the means to take revenge. So she's like tagging along with Supergirl, who's coincidentally going after the same villain, right? She has him sword to his neck. She's like, I'm gonna do my revenge now. And Supergirl is like, no, you can't. Because if you do murder, it's gonna be with you for the rest of your life and you'll always regret it and have to think about him. Meanwhile, she has murdered like Supergirl, I mean, has murdered like a hundred people in the movie so far. And she's like, you cannot kill this one man that killed your entire family.

SPEAKER_00 13:42

I was like, no, why, Supergirl? Just let this girl do her thing. She's gonna like regret this moment forever when you didn't let her do it.

SPEAKER_01 13:52

But on the other hand, like, if if the movie had let her do it, like that's also really dark. You know what I mean? Like, then you're you are turning a 13-year-old girl into a murderer. I'm like, how am I supposed to feel? This is like such a moral quandary. Both options are bad. So they just like give her a different partner. This is not good.

SPEAKER_03 14:14

The ending is definitely the weakest part of the movie. Uh well, also, I didn't like the beginning that much either. But that middle, that middle really got to me. The middle is interesting, I gotta say. Um, all right, whatever. Super, I feel bad for talking about Feliciano hasn't fully seen it, so we ruined it for him a little bit. Um, and perhaps you listening at home too.

SPEAKER_01 14:34

I mean, I've been on the internet in my life, so don't reason Will wanted to get this the Spider-Man ticket because like if we don't see it right away, the internet is gonna ruin it for me. I was like, okay, fair.

SPEAKER_04 14:45

Yeah, we got tickets for the ninth, so I will just be ducking and weaving till then. No boy.

SPEAKER_03 14:50

Um okay. Should we talk about X-Men? Should we get X-Men?

SPEAKER_01 14:56

Probably should, yes.

SPEAKER_03 14:57

Okay. Strangeland Savage Heart. This episode rocked. Uh I the thing I like most about it is it it unapologetically refers to the original series in multiple confusing ways. If you have not watched the original series or not familiar with the X-Men in a detailed way, and I just liked it. It was just like a straight-up like continuation of various episodes from the OG series, and it was all and they nailed all the characterizations too, between Nightcrawler, Colossus, absolutely did Rating Creed. Uh, I mean, just like the whole thing was just like I I just wonder how it comes across as someone who hasn't like bothered to watch the original series, but they like X-Men 97 at I think they did a good job of like sneaking the exposition in.

SPEAKER_04 15:43

Um, for if you if you haven't uh or or are not like a comic fan. Uh yeah, I think they did it. It is yes, let me not go off on a tangent. I think, yeah, I oh sorry, go ahead. No, I think they did a good job of getting the exposition in and like quickly recapping like the messy family um unit that they have there uh with Creed. And I appreciated they said the quiet part out loud. I feel like with Creed a lot of the time it's just like, hey, this is someone who should have gotten mutant powers by genetics, didn't, and is raging a war against mutants because of it. And abusive parents, yes, obviously.

SPEAKER_03 16:22

So like do you think that's justified? That's how you would feel if your parents were superpowered mutants and you just grew up and were Feliciano.

SPEAKER_04 16:29

I'm not gonna lie, if there were mutants in the world and I was not one of them, I would not be okay. So wait, does that mean you just in general, even if you had human parents in humanity or just I would not be a friend of humanity, but I would I would be looking, I would probably, oh god, I would probably be, what is it, one of the the Z-men?

SPEAKER_03 16:47

Um that's disturbing.

SPEAKER_04 16:50

Yeah, uh, yeah, it really is.

SPEAKER_03 16:52

Listen, you're in the Marvel universe. There's so many ways for you to get superpowers. You do not have to be born away.

SPEAKER_04 16:57

Well, that's what I was I was like, realistically, I'd probably track down someone like what's his face, uh, the guy Ink went to, uh, the tattoo artist, and just be like, give me a bunch of tattoo superpowers, please. No one needs to know but me. I'll put them all in somewhere that I'll keep covered and discreet.

SPEAKER_01 17:11

Um just hang out by a nuclear reactor or something.

SPEAKER_03 17:14

Something's gonna happen, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:16

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_03 17:17

Yeah, jump into various trucks carrying chemicals. Um my favorite all-time onion headlines was local teen science with Peter Parker gets bitten by a radioactive spider, dies. And then the story is like about how he got leukemia and died horribly within a couple of months, and he'll be remembered fondly by his Aunt May and Uncle Ben. Oh god, that's great. And they even had a line from Flash Thompson in the obituary talking about how he was a wimp or something. Um, all right. Uh yeah, okay, so this episode was good. Uh oh, just briefly, uh, in the intro, Polaris is gets like a tile card, which is fine. She does.

SPEAKER_04 18:01

And I can't wait till next week because, or at least probably given their pattern the week after, uh, to get one for Colossus.

SPEAKER_03 18:09

Um, see that we gotta talk about Colossus being next man at the end. Uh that's a long-running thread. Um, and then they show like other scenes from these episodes they're referencing Mystique and Nightcrawler in the opening credits, and also like the episode um where Apocalypse helped Grading Creed like create this mutant virus from season two that cable's and Bishop are traveling back in time to stop. Like, that's that's such an awesome reference because those are some of my favorite episodes ever. Yeah. Um and so this episode opens. We're back in Genosha, much like not Man of Steel, uh the Justice League movie, right? Where Ben Affleck is back in Man of Steel and he's at the destruction of Metropolis. Here we see that, but with Colossus was out in Genosha, and he's fighting with his sister Magic, Ileana.

SPEAKER_04 19:04

Killing Magic off the bat was quite it was a flex. There's no other word for it. Because like I was like, oh, they're gonna do the same thing with they did with Magneto. She'll disappear in the green, and then we'll get her later on with her devil soul.

SPEAKER_03 19:18

And then they sort of thought that was happening.

SPEAKER_04 19:20

And then they showed her body, and I was like, wait, what?

SPEAKER_03 19:24

I don't like that at all. Well, doesn't I think a little Ileana when I read the comics in the 90s, she like becomes a little kid again. Like that was like a I don't know if she died though. Something happens where she gets reversed into like a little girl and a po uh Colossus has to raise her. Yeah, but I does she have comics where she dies and comes back to life.

SPEAKER_04 19:42

Is that part of I I I honestly don't know. I only ever seen her in like them in like a longer story or story arcs. Um, I never chased down her individual stuff. Um I'm just like maybe they still will have a thing where like her soul went to hell and she comes back. Yeah, because like it is she it's she she appeared to have her soul sort of ready, but like I was just like, wow, you're just you're dumping magic just like that.

SPEAKER_03 20:07

I I'm so mad they killed her. I think she's way too cool of a character, and they also presented her awesomely too in the like little brief scenes you get her as. Uh uh, I don't know. Oh, Feliciano, your thoughts on the new mutants movie. Did you ever watch that? I did.

SPEAKER_04 20:23

I thought um I appreciate what they attempted to do. It was it's been a while, and so like I I don't want to misspeak about like you get a movie like that where in my mind I I see it playing out like this, like someone's just like, let's do a new mutants movie, and then they're just like, Okay, here's a script for new mutants by someone who who's love and tended new mutants their life, and they write these characters and they write a situation, and then executives look at it and they're just like, We're gonna change all of these things for demographics, and then that's the movie get that gets made, and you're just like, Well, this does not work anymore. Um, there was a lot of like it was like why are we in an asylum? Why is this random group like how did we get here? Like, even like I feel like even with that group, if you wanted to do a horror thing, there are plenty ways to do a horror. This was not one of them. Um so yeah, I I I I think it kind of comes down to what you were saying about Supergirl, where like the actors I think did a very good job with what they were given, but what they were given didn't hold up.

SPEAKER_03 21:38

Okay, well, I asked well I th the best part of the movie I think probably was Anya Taylor Joy as magic, though. Am I crazy for thinking that? Like, especially by the end of the movie, I thought she was like uh when they give her something more to do and she's got uh what's his name? Kitty Pride's dragon. Uh uh Lockheed.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

Oh yeah, Lockheed.

SPEAKER_03 22:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:06

I I did appreciate that.

SPEAKER_03 22:09

I think that was like just inspired bit of casting. Uh just uh Anya Taylor Joy as magic. I agree. I also really liked Maisie Williams. Um yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_04 22:18

She's uh Wolfsbane. I always I can never remember which one of those it is. It's Wolfsbane or the other one.

SPEAKER_03 22:28

Um yeah, she was great as that character. I think it was Wolfsbane. Well, yeah, I think she was Wolfsbane. But the guy from Stranger Things as Cannonball sucked. Uh oh yeah. Sunspot, uh, there's like criticism of the casting because he was too light-skinned.

SPEAKER_04 22:45

Yeah. I again I don't think it was that I th I don't think Cannonball was written well.

SPEAKER_02 22:53

No.

SPEAKER_04 22:53

Um but you have Cannonball and you have Sunspot. You kind of gotta let them both just be themselves, which is a little over the top. And like you trying to create that power dynamic where like, oh, one is a quiet introvert, like it doesn't, it's not his character. Um you remember more about this movie than I do.

SPEAKER_01 23:15

I cannot remember the character. I know I saw it. I have like brief flashes in my mind. That's about it.

SPEAKER_03 23:21

I remember the evil scientist lady uh who is orchestrating the whole thing for crazy reasons.

SPEAKER_04 23:26

Who, if I recall, they took what's her name? Uh Reyes, the one who creates uh Shields, who's supposed to be a good guy. I was like, why is she a villain? Is she a villain at some point in the story that I'm unfamiliar with?

SPEAKER_03 23:39

They're just like, she's got a cool power, let's make her a villain. The movie was famously a clusterfuck. Like, I think it was in development hell for years, and then it was finally released like three years after they filmed it, so who knows? Uh, but I mean that that's like I I mean, just I just bring it up because I'm sad that Magic is dead in this cartoon, and I'm sad that Anya Taylor Joy didn't get a better movie to play Magic. Uh, because I think she's a very interesting character, especially with her brother Colossus. I love the picture.

SPEAKER_04 24:07

I mean, it's not too late.

SPEAKER_01 24:08

It can still bring her.

SPEAKER_04 24:09

I was gonna say, I was gonna say, I thought I heard something or saw something like that, but that could just been someone being like, I hope they bring her back. She's gonna show up in Secret Wars somehow. It's like a well in uh in Doomsday would be insane. I mean, we got we got we we got uh Chris's uh Johnny Storm again, which who saw that coming? Best sucker punch I've seen I've gotten in years.

SPEAKER_03 24:34

Um, okay. Alright, so Ileana was just killed by those sentinels. It's kind of surprising that she's just standing there considering she could teleport around. I don't know why she took the that blast. I don't know what her thought process was in her death, but she's dead. Colossus is mourning over her dead body and screens. The actor playing Colossus is pretty great. I think it might be the original voice actor. I could be mistaken, but he definitely sounds exactly like the original guy from the original series. Uh that was a heart-render heart-rending moment. And then we cut to uh Grading Creed is announcing his run for presidency of the United States, which is quite the political, like explicitly political moment in X-Men, which we were sort of criticizing. Like we said last week, we're saying, oh, the show's like not really going there like it was going there in season one. They're back to going there now with the announcement of Grading Creed's uh presidency.

SPEAKER_04 25:29

And just I I I rewatched that scene just because one, because I wanted to identify which acolytes they were using, and two, I just wanted to hear all of the little like racist voiceovers in the background while he was talking. It was like I I just love the idea of that actor, those actors and actresses being in the room, just like, yeah, humans first.

SPEAKER_03 25:53

Alright, we gotta talk about we gotta go in a divergent discussion here about the Friends of Humanity's the realistic role they would play if this was real. Like if this was real politics. Oh my god. It I the Friends of Humanity are bad. We are X-Men fans, we know they're bad, they're coded as bad guys. All that being said, if this was real, if mutants were real, I can imagine people of all sorts of political persuasions being massively thrown for a loop with like this the mutant issue. There's just no getting around it. And I say that because uh when we watched X-Men 97 last week, it rolled into X-Men 1, the first movie, and that movie opens with Gene Gray speaking to Congress talking about mutants, and Senator Kelly gets up and is like saying, like, mutants can just like walk into banks or take over our minds. Like, we literally have to do something about them. Like they're they're extremely powerful, and everyone's applauding him. It's a completely bipartisan issue. And I'm watching it, I'm thinking, like, yeah, Senator Kelly's a jackass, but like I I think I might be afraid if I lived in a world of mutants as a regular human being. Well, so you get that dual edition. Like Medicare for All and other things. The Green New Deal.

SPEAKER_04 27:12

So here's the thing, though, like it's always to me, the mutant issue, especially like from the terms of the Friends of Humanity, are very much like uh a Cold War issue. It's like we have to prevent the rise of communism before communism arrives, but by antagonizing communists, uh, they attack us. And it's just like you are you you're you're forming it's the snake eating its own tail, like you're making things worse. You you've every I will say the difference is with the exception of like apocalypse, every major mutant villain is just like you attacked and killed us, we're going to respond. So it is always a response to behavior. It's never just like we woke up one morning and we're like, let's kill the humans. It was like the humans killed us because they were afraid we could potentially do something. So now we're going to do something.

SPEAKER_03 28:04

Uh before I say anything, because I guess I'm a friends of humanity defender for some reason. So, yeah, what what's your take on the this whole turn? Political I know.

SPEAKER_01 28:17

Um I mean that like is very tricky, right? Because people are afraid of what the mutants might do. So then they respond. So then it becomes kind of an issue of faith. Then we get into like a religion kind of territory instead of just strictly political, because it's like, then it's like people have to take on faith that if they don't do anything to provoke the mutants, they will be benevolent towards humanity.

SPEAKER_04 28:45

Counterpoint. Yeah. In this world, mutants aren't the only people with superpowers by far. And like, so specifically, it's it's that like joke on the internet where they're just like, oh, what are you? This is like, oh, I'm a super soldier. Oh, what are you? Oh, I you know, I I developed, I felt I got Dallas in chemicals. What are you? Oh, I was born a mutant, and they spit on the mutant. It just it's like in this world, I will first of all, it is bigotry, yeah. In this world, when when when when it's just the world, I will take a little of that. The second that first alien shows up with superpowers, it's just like, oh, okay, I'm gonna need our superpower people to like defend against the space superpower people because they've also got technology on their side, clearly. So, like, we're we need to level this playing field somehow, but like, yeah, I mean in the Marvel verse, you're living in a verse where fantastic things are possible and humans are far behind.

SPEAKER_03 29:43

And like about the humans too, Feliciano, they are also way over the top in their first action against the mutants. They invent gaiju sized robots, the size of skyscrapers, that shoot like super powerful laser beams from their hands and menacingly like talk to people on the street. Like, that is a crazy overreaction for this problem. All for the want of men going to therapy. So I I think like the human side is outrageous. Uh, so I I am being swayed away again from the Friends of Humanity. I I am creeped out though. I think if I was sitting there in this universe, I'd be creeped out about telepaths more than anything. That really scares me. Uh I I think it would make me into like a psychotic like conspiracy theorist of just like and shapeshifters too would really kind of terrify me at the same time.

SPEAKER_04 30:34

I I I I I don't know. I don't think my thoughts are that interesting.

SPEAKER_01 30:37

Um I think that would be the main point, right? For most telepaths, like most people's thoughts would not be that interesting.

SPEAKER_04 30:43

Yeah. I don't got enough going on in there. Um I will for hold on. What I just completely lost the train of thought. I'll I'll say this too though, before Oh, going sorry, two back.

SPEAKER_03 30:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 30:58

Uh because you were a Friends of Humanity defender, I'm gonna go off and defend the thing that I was like, okay, I kinda see this. The collars and the power dampeningers. That I could be like, well, if you're a regular human, I work. Let's not tell people where I work. I work in a heavily populated area. Okay. Uh I would want power dampeners everywhere there, even if I was a mutant, because like it is a pri as it is, it's a prime target for anyone who wants to do some stupid shit.

SPEAKER_03 31:33

Like, it would be people can't control their powers as we see the most well-intentioned characters.

SPEAKER_04 31:40

Yeah, there's uh so like I can see that being the first response. Yeah, like that being your first response. Like, if a mutant is popping off, pop a collar. It's not great. Um, but like it's it's it's definitely that thing where it's just be like, okay, well, you can't control your powers, or you've proven yourself dangerous. We're not gonna lock you up, but we will make you wear this suppression collar. Um, like in the very same way people get like anklets to like for house arrest, like you were on power arrest. You don't get to use your powers because you tried to kill a bunch of people. Like, I feel like that's fair.

SPEAKER_03 32:18

I'd also say I I want to push back. You said earlier that the mutants, like, they're just responding to attacks from humans. That's not entirely true because if you take it back to the original X-Men comics, a lot of the early mutants are just like dumbass bank robbers and like hoodlums, and and the X-Men are out there stopping them from robbing banks. So I I think uh I well, I I just I think we've come to like a good consensus that I think if you could have power dampeners uh like we see in this episode, the Mr. Sinister Power Inhibitor, if you could just put that on the Tower of the Empire State Building and have it like radiate to protect the city.

SPEAKER_01 32:55

Just have like one big one for every major like intro area, maybe that would do it.

SPEAKER_04 33:00

And like and I say that as someone who, again, in this verse, I would fully want to be a mutant, hands down.

SPEAKER_01 33:06

Um I don't know, it just feels wrong to like argue for the friends of humanity still, though, because it's like they're oh absolutely they're so like MAGA coded.

SPEAKER_04 33:18

They're bigots exactly, just actually given the timeline, it's the other way around. MAGA is Friends of Humanity coded.

SPEAKER_01 33:27

Exactly. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 33:30

Um I mean, I mean that's a credit to this episode of like them just uh directly parallel linking MAGA with Friends of Humanity. There's just no escaping it. And um it's also just like they give you this insane like liberal power fantasy of uh like a like a squad of rolling up mercenaries like showing up to Trump's like announcement speech and arresting him before he could be become elected again. You know what I mean? Like that.

SPEAKER_04 33:56

I'm not gonna lie. When Creed was talking, I was just like, please just let the building start shaking and someone come. And then it didn't, I was like, Yes, I was not expecting the acolytes, but I was just like, oh, I will take this. I will have to take care of the problem. Someone's taking care of the problem.

SPEAKER_03 34:11

I was taking yeah, go on, sorry.

SPEAKER_04 34:13

Yeah, no, and like moving, pushing on to like the other the main part of the story. I in the very same token where I was just like, we I I helped you defend Friends of Humanity for a split second, I'm gonna defend the acolytes right now, because like I get it, Nightcrawler. I get it, I get it, but like you're a shitty childhood does not excuse mass murder. No, no, and and like genocide. It doesn't I said too.

SPEAKER_01 34:42

When he delivered his sorry, I'm we're getting ahead of it a little bit, but when he delivered his argument, I was like, that did no no, like and Colossus agreed.

SPEAKER_03 34:54

I I agree with you guys. By the end of the episode, I was I I'm on the side of the acolytes completely. I'm not uh the I think the acolytes were totally justified in doing everything they did and like apprehending this man.

SPEAKER_01 35:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 35:08

Because he's a I mean, he's like a psychopath that like has like attempted genocide on his resume, amongst other crimes.

SPEAKER_01 35:15

I mean, he doesn't have any superpowers, so maybe they didn't need to like do the weird like crucifixion uh handcuffing sort of thing that they did to him. They could have just put him in a jail cell, I guess.

SPEAKER_04 35:26

I mean, that was for shits and gangs. Like they were just like, we have him, we might as well.

SPEAKER_03 35:30

They're gonna humiliate him.

SPEAKER_04 35:32

I mean, the funny thing is, like, they the accolades two were kind of reasonable, I thought, in their demands. Very much so, which is why the one criticism I have is the the ninth hour turn, where they were just like, where uh Exodus didn't wait for Colossus to give a verdict. He was just like, fuck this, I'm evil now. And I was like, of course you had to do that.

SPEAKER_03 35:55

Yeah, like the Acolytes' demands, as we see here in this news report, is that they're like, you have 24 hours to release all the mutant set X Factors apprehended, then we'll give you Graden Creed back, which then presumably means Graden Creed can go continue to run for president and be like this big evil behemoth, you know, upon the world. So they're not like I feel like their demands were rather light, actually. Like I I'm not gonna say they're humane, but they were I don't know, they they're just they weren't like saying like we're killing this guy because he can't be president of the United States. It was like, do whatever you want politically, but we need our prisoners freed.

SPEAKER_04 36:36

It was very reasonable because like one of the things, and part of the reason I like that they took the time to do the episode where Polaris leaves, is that X Factor, I I them I hate. Like, and I appreciate I you always hate to hear the words race trainer, but I was just kind of like, I'm okay with this Exodus. Yes, they are the fucking worst.

SPEAKER_01 36:58

Um that should have been part of his demands, actually, was like that X Factor should be disbanded.

SPEAKER_03 37:04

Yeah. There was a there's an internet fan theory I'll just drop on everyone. Uh there's a theory that Dr. Cooper's Mystique. I don't know if there's much evidence of it, uh, other than it'd just be it'd be cool if she was.

SPEAKER_01 37:20

I mean, we all want to see Mystique, so yeah. Yeah, it would be cool.

SPEAKER_03 37:23

And you see her standing next to President Kelly in this episode, and like famously Mystique interacts with President Kelly in the movies, you know, sure in the comics as well. So that'd be a fun twist.

SPEAKER_04 37:36

Yeah, go on. That would be interesting. I just wouldn't know what her endgame would be there. Um, but yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:46

Uh so uh Creed is captured and chained rather satisfyingly. Uh Colossus looks great in this episode. It's just his sound of design is amazing, and the way he's drawn with those heavy like black lines. Uh it looks just incredible. Like he's like he's the best drawn character, along with Nightcrawler on the show in general, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_01 38:07

Yes, and Nightcrawler really shines in the scene.

SPEAKER_04 38:10

Nightcrawler looked so good. I remember I was watching when I was watching, I was like, man, they really did justice.

SPEAKER_03 38:15

Um glowing eyeballs alone is yeah, it made me think like they should have done that for the like why didn't he have the glowing eyes in the movies? I mean, I guess that'd be a little distracting, but still, it looks so much better.

SPEAKER_01 38:25

Hardest to execute, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:26

I also found myself being like, wow, his hair is great.

SPEAKER_01 38:29

Just I was like, look. Um effect.

SPEAKER_04 38:36

Oh, I've loved it since season one. His BAMF effect is wonderful, and like a teleporting sword battle is just everything I could have wanted. Yes, it was so good.

SPEAKER_03 38:45

Yeah, this is an S-tier episode. I mean, I I think mainly in general, because of Colossus and Nightcrawler, are two classic X-Men characters that were, you know, they were like cameo level guys in the original series. You were thrilled to see them, and they were never really on the team. And now, like, this show is just like they're on the team and uh here they are, and their main characters, I mean, like they always should have been, is is like it it's just great to see them interacting in this episode.

SPEAKER_04 39:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 39:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 39:15

I will also in terms of interaction in this episode. I don't know of any, I don't know this from the comics at all, so someone feel free to comment if it's a thing. It's perhaps the flirtation between uh the Bishop and Polaris that seems to be like being put down.

SPEAKER_01 39:34

It's like, oh, there's gonna be romance.

SPEAKER_03 39:37

Yeah, I don't know if that's from anywhere either, but well, I mean that's why X-Men is so great because every character is sexy and any combination of them like potentially works, and it's just amazing to open you can open a chapter in any kind of romance you can think of, and it it's there's uh something you know titillating about it. Okay, so uh as we said, uh the accolades have made their demands. Um Nightcrawler is watching on the news. Oh, we see some mutants in jail, they're also somehow getting this news too. Pyro and Avalanche are captured in a cell, they're celebrating um uh 24 hours, uh then uh Creed dies. I called them Greed in my notes. G-R-E-E-D. That's stupid. Uh anyway, um Nightcrawler's like reviewing the case. Uh he he reminds the audience that they're both the son of Mystique, but they have different fathers. Yeah. I think uh Nightcrawler's dad is Azazel from my the research that I did. I could be wrong on that.

SPEAKER_04 40:45

So it gets rewrit it's there are it gets rewritten all the time. There are versions where Mystique is his mother, is his father. Um what? Whoa, it it it it goes all over the place with that one. Um, which was you know, answers the fan theory when Mystique's a man, does she have sperm? Apparently. Um now you just got me into this whole weird artificial insemination of Mystique doing it too. I also I also like the I I also like the versions where Azazel is his father. Um I mean it makes sense. Yeah. Well they did, I think, was it in the new mutants where they did the run where they they touched on the whole thing about like angelic mutants and demonic mutants? Yeah. Um with Icarus and one of the and Archangel. Um I always thought that was really interesting, but I could see how a little too faith-based mixed in to like our fun world of uh of uh mutants.

SPEAKER_03 41:42

Uh I mean and the Nightcrawler's like backstory is so messy because he's raised by gypsies in a circus and or Romani people. I I don't I don't want I don't know how offensive it is saying gypsy. Uh and in the comics they called them gypsies at the time. And it's like he's got he's like he's friends or enemies with all these demonic type characters, too, like witches and enchantresses and things as well. Is like that's part of his backstory, and he's got like ex-girlfriends that like have powers, and it's just his his like extended network of friends and family is like so interesting to me between you know mystique, rogue, uh you know, creed. It's like insane. Um, so just I I just like that they're just unafraid of just laying that all out there in this cartoon of like giving you a taste of like, yeah, this is Nightcrawler's backstory. We're not like watering it down anyway. Yeah, he's got all these like bizarre familial connections. Um Cooper, Dr. Cooper is on like a holo conference with Xavier. She's begging him not to intervene. And Xavier, he's like, he's all he's like pissed, he's like, Oh, I'm intervening alright. Like, I'm sending the expert to the savage land, and you trust me I don't want to go there. He's also like mad that Exodus is twisting Magneto's philosophy for his own ends. So Magneto is like trying to defend like what he thinks I'm not Magneto. Xavier's trying to defend what he thinks Magneto's like true philosophy is.

SPEAKER_04 43:12

Would you want someone you know ruining the beliefs of your ex?

SPEAKER_03 43:20

Um okay, and then uh and then so then like the team that's going off to the Savage Land, it's Bishop, Polaris, Nightcrawler, and Beast. Uh I like this team. That was it's just this just reminds me of the X-Men Comics. And Rogue. And Rogue. Oh, Rogue, yes. It reminds me of the X-Men comics. You just pick the mutants you like, and sometimes your favorite characters are in the comic you're reading, and sometimes they're not. And this is just a nice assortment of guys. Like in the original, the one of the biggest things that we complained about in the original series is like they were just married to the main cast, no matter what. And like occasionally they'd add a they would add Colossus, but he wouldn't be part of. The X-Men, he would just sort of be a like a focus as like a cameo guy in an episode. He wouldn't be on the team. Famously, they'd always ask him to join, and he'd never say yes. So we might find at the end of this episode, it seems like we get a resolution. Because of Iliana. Right. Yeah, you're right. Yeah, yeah. Um, okay. So they're off to the Savage Land, which is great. Uh, they're wearing their sort of Grant Morrison era uniforms, which is new.

SPEAKER_04 44:26

This is one of the areas, though, where I'm just like, okay, I guess I will suspend this disbelief. Beast is a genius. Beast is a mutant genius. Yeah. Someone takes over the savage land. I'm going to assume right away that they're fixing the power dampening thing. I'm going to assume right away they're gonna fuck with our plane. And they're just like, nah, it's all good. We're just gonna plow on in there.

SPEAKER_03 44:52

I think Beast is distracted this season. Well, underused, yeah. Is there like he's underused, but he's also something's off with him.

SPEAKER_04 45:00

He's just like not so in the recap, and I'm always I'm always I always want to see the recaps because like what they choose to focus on there to me always is like uh hey, what's gonna happen here? And like they specifically pulled up the line I mentioned where they were just like evil beast, where it's just like you know, maybe the professor's vision was a little short-sighted, which is what so they had him say that in the recap, and then he's in this story where he doesn't really do much except for like in the background, one of the funniest, most disrespectful things ever. Uh, Rogue punches the big guy down, and as Beast is running along, and he just sort of hops on the body that has as Rogue uh that rogue just punched. I was just like, that's just a great little background gag.

SPEAKER_03 45:44

And then make it feel sound effect when he does it too.

SPEAKER_04 45:46

Yeah. Um, but yeah, I was just like, and so then now he's in this story that raises the morality question of like what where do we stand and like what should our relationship to people be? So I'm hoping they're building a case to make I don't want beast to be evil, but like it would lead to compelling television.

SPEAKER_01 46:05

It probably would, but like I would hope that they also give him a few more like plot points and moments uh as just himself so that you can like appreciate the change a little bit better for people who haven't seen the show.

SPEAKER_03 46:18

You know what, you know what this show needs? I've just uh this fucking just hit me. Speedball. At the well, yes, at the end of each season, they need to do a fucking movie length uh tie-up. They need to make a 65-70 minute you know, hour 10, doesn't have to be a full movie, but for the purposes of you know, like like those DC animated movies, that would be so great. Because then you can have an extra like super stuffed long conclusion thing. I like if they just had the budget or the time to do that, that'd be beautiful. And if they're really ambitious, you've released that sucker and a limited release in the theaters, and I'd be very happy to see the an animated expert on the big screen.

SPEAKER_04 47:04

I cannot imagine I like when the first one came out. I can't imagine that it didn't do so well that they would have put more money behind it. Like they wouldn't like put more money behind it, give us more episodes, give us more anything. It's doing well, it did well, it's doing well.

SPEAKER_03 47:19

We know drama behind the scenes after season one that they had to that just must be the reason that they just they had to take a step back.

SPEAKER_01 47:29

Maybe it'll be the uh the anime pattern, five seasons and three movies, and uh and we're on our way.

SPEAKER_03 47:36

That'd be nice. Um, so uh they're hit by this Mr. Sinister Inhibitor Ray, which they bring back from the original series, which is great. I love that. That's such a specific reference. Uh they all they don't have powers, the plane is shot down by missiles. Bishop uh he absorbs a bunch of energy that he can't release, we find out, and he becomes a ticking time bond. If he can't release the energy, he's gonna die. And like as Bishop's falling out the plane, Polaris like does an insane Tom Cruise maneuver where she leaps out of the plane, grabs a parachute out of the scrap sky, and saves Bishop at the last second. And that that's a nice little action sequence, very enjoyable. Uh shows how capable she is. Um, and then you're in the Savage Land, there's like a T-Rex running around. Uh, I love the Savage Land as a setting for the X-Men. The Savage Land is what like a S-tier X-Men setting place, in my opinion. Agreed. I'm always happy. They should do a Savage Land movie at some point. That would just be fun.

SPEAKER_01 48:32

Uh this is also where you get like the romance moment because like they kind of like land on top of each other and then they're like hiding from the T-Rex, and like it looks like things are gonna happen there.

SPEAKER_04 48:44

Yeah, they're they're they're wild enough for each other. It is kind of the animation's great.

SPEAKER_03 48:49

The sparks between Bishop and uh Polaris are a lot of fun. They they're really like winking at each other dramatically. Uh the other X-Men are crashed, they're okay. Colossus comes upon them, and I like the friendly rapport of c between Colossus and his friends, especially with Nightcrawler. Uh that you know, they're just like two classic friendly X-Men.

SPEAKER_01 49:10

This is also like refreshing for any kind of superhero content, really. Like two teams with opposing viewpoints meet each other. Usually you just get a big fight, and everyone wants to see like all these mutants are fighting each other, but they don't. They have a civil conversation and they're like, You agree to see our point of view, we agree to see yours, we're not gonna hurt each other right now. Let's talk.

SPEAKER_03 49:34

Yeah. Although Beast does shame Colossus a little bit. He's like, Your sister never would have wanted you to join the Acolytes. Yeah, he did. Yeah, and uh, you know, Colossus is like, well, you know, sorry, Beast, I'm not I'm not as big of a dork as you are. Uh and then they take them to the citadel, and uh they see like this shrine to Magneto, and there's a painting that Colossus made. We know he's an artist, he made of his sister magic. Uh uh, I like that touch too. They're reminding you of the painterly side of Colossus, which is like a fun I mean Colossus is such a great character. I like how they show him in the beginning when he's on Jenoshin in his original costume with the red and the yellow. Yeah, he's basically wearing like the flag of the Soviet Union as his costume. And he's just like he's like Russian Captain America, but like unironically a good guy, which that that never struck me before. I never really thought about that. They just basically wearing the flag of his country, like Captain America, and it's never like played off like he's some Soviet, you know, like villain in the past.

SPEAKER_04 50:40

They did that, they had him in that, and then Magic was wearing an ex-suit, and I was just like, ha. What okay? Sure. I mean, that is that her new mutants costume, yeah. But like there's no context for her being on an ex team in this. Um, so I thought she was gonna have her black. Um, especially since she has her sword.

SPEAKER_03 51:03

Isn't she she's like a little girl in the original series two, which is basically like a year before the show takes place. Yeah. So none of that makes sense. Kubernetes hit her like a brick. Well, that's um Ileana again with like her aging is always gonna be weird. Maybe you could chalk it up to that. Uh okay. So Nightcrawler is.

SPEAKER_04 51:23

They also had a painting of Squid Boy. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:27

You know what I'm saying? See no amphibian in this episode. He was one of my favorite characters in the Savage Land, the Slurping Guy, Sonya.

SPEAKER_01 51:34

Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_03 51:36

Um that was our favorite character from those episodes. Uh, he's just like a big frog man. Anyway, yeah. Uh Kree is chained up in a jail. He doesn't accept Nightcrawler as his brother. He's like, if you're gonna kill me, kill me. Nightcrawl is also wearing like a priest outfit underneath his X-Men suit.

SPEAKER_04 51:53

I noted that too.

SPEAKER_03 51:54

Yeah, he has his collar on. And then uh Exodus shows up, he's like sort of rubbing salt in the wound by like not fostering any goodwill between any of these characters uh that Nightcrawler's trying to foster, like trying to like ease tensions and get this guy out of prison. And Nightcrawler suggests this whole like cry trial for grading Creed. Rogue thinks it's a bad idea, Creed thinks it's like a he's smiling, he knows he can manipulate the situation somehow. And uh and the stakes are like if Nightcrawler wins the trial, uh Creed goes free. If he loses, uh Nightcrawler will join the Acolytes, and I guess Creed dies. Uh, you know, they give in to his demands or whatever, uh Exodus's demands.

SPEAKER_01 52:39

And Nightcrawler demands that Colossus has to be the judge. Oh, yeah, that's fun.

SPEAKER_03 52:43

That's a great detail.

SPEAKER_01 52:44

Yeah, that's really good.

SPEAKER_03 52:46

Uh I mean, this is a good episode. This is a good premise. This is fun.

SPEAKER_04 52:50

I I will also say though, especially since she I they gave her the line in the f in in the first one. They just completely ignore Amelia in the background there. She just she doesn't have a line, she doesn't say anything. They're just like, oh, this is what happens after you left Genosha. You came and you joined these guys. Not a word. She's just sort of like back there, just staring and looking. Yeah. Oh, wait, what can Amelia? Amelia, uh, yeah. She uh Oh, she's um, yeah, go on. I'm sorry. Uh Charles' ex. Her power is turning into gas. She's deaf, she's they they I think at one point while someone else is talking, Beast actively looks back at her. I think it's Beast. And I'm just like, I was like, oh, so we're gonna no, we're just we're just gonna let that go. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 53:36

I'll be honest with that. I totally miss that. That's insane that they just they have her, but she's just a background character. Okay. Um, meanwhile, Bishop and Playeris, they find some guns and they're gonna go after the inhibitor tower. They they like have some fun ideas and how to crazily take it down. Creed doesn't recognize the kangaroo court he's been thrown into. He's also being whipped by this one guy with like a laser whip. Uh a lot of laser whips in fantasy, I think. It's a psionic whip.

SPEAKER_04 54:02

That's what's his that's that's his psychic power. He just makes a whip. Nice. Or he like psionics the whip.

SPEAKER_03 54:09

Does Psylock have those powers too?

SPEAKER_04 54:11

Is it or is it just with swords that she could Silock changes all the time depending on who's writing it? Uh, because like in in the X-verse, it seems every telepath is also telekinetic when they feel like it. Right. Um, and in varying degrees, and like I think at times she has done other things. I'm not sh I like I feel like there have been times where I'm just like, oh, I guess she can do that too. Um Quintin straight up made a gun. Okay, like a gun, which I love.

SPEAKER_03 54:44

Uh and then and then when Professor X is evil, he has like insanely amazing powers and he never really shows, too, where he could do way more than you think he can just with telepathy. So you're right, like the telepathy stuff is kind of like whatever the writer wants to do. Whatever, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 55:00

Um I will say I was going over I I like I said I rund to see like which acolytes they were using. Because like again, part of the fun is seeing the expanded verse and seeing like all the other people, and like I couldn't remember some of them.

SPEAKER_03 55:18

Yeah, me neither. I mean the the acolytes to me it's like a it's a bit of a it's a bit of like a dark spot for me in my X-Men knowledge. I just mainly know them from the X-Men animated series. I guess I remember them in like the Jim Lee comics in the early 90s, they they make an appearance on Astrid M that you see the acolytes with Fabian Cortez as one of the characters, and he's definitely in the original series.

SPEAKER_04 55:40

Well, I also always confuse the one that's on the Acolytes, uh oh god, what's it the Frenzy with Cypher, even though they are too uh good good Cypher, Cypher with the eye, not the one that the comics consistently try to make try to get me to everyone to like. I don't care that your power is language. I really don't.

SPEAKER_03 56:01

I love that's what I thought you were talking about at first.

SPEAKER_04 56:05

Oh no, no, Cypher with the eye. Uh Cipher with the eye, who is basically a cross between Shadow Cat and Forget Me Not. Um just like you, I you you only perceive me when I want you to be perceived when I want to be perceived. Um but yeah, no, they it it's frenzy. I would this she did the super strength thing and I was like, oh, it's the other one. Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_03 56:26

Um I mean the acolytes are mostly background characters in this episode. They're not Yeah, they're not they don't get the flushed cameoed. Uh all right, so the trial it kicks off. Uh I I liked Exus's prosecution where he's like, you tried to like kill all the mutants with the mutant virus, you tried to blame the pres like a president's death on a mutant, and uh uh, yeah. You formed the friends of humanity, you are like a Hitlerite type character. Fuck you. And then that's the whole case. And then uh Nightcrawler starts going where he's like, Oh, you were you had such a troubled childhood. And I think like I get where Nightcrawler's going, and I appreciated that Nightcrawler was a good therapist.

SPEAKER_01 57:14

Uh much better than Professor X, actually.

SPEAKER_03 57:17

You know Lee's leagues better. I mean fully diagnoses this guy's psychological problems, like pins it down to his mother and father.

SPEAKER_01 57:25

Questioning Creed. So Creed is like an active participant in this defense case, which also makes it like a little bit more effective than it would have been otherwise. But basically, what it comes down to is he's like, Your mother was mystique, your father was saber-tooth, they both treated you terrible and abandoned you at like a very young age, and you didn't have any superpowers, and that's why you're mad. You're not actually angry at all mutants, you're just angry at your two parents who were shitty parents and happened to be mutants, and that's why you came out the way that you did. But what are we arguing here, really, Nightcrawler?

SPEAKER_03 58:02

Yeah, uh Colossus is about to render a decision and he hesitates too long, so Exodus is like, fuck you, Colossus. He starts attacking Colossus with his powers, and then he's about to execute Creed, and then uh like a full-on fight ensues where uh like Nightcrawler like jumps in to saves Creed's life. Oh, in the meantime, too, Bishop and Polaris are riding a bunch of pterodactyls and blow up the inhibitor tower.

SPEAKER_04 58:26

I love that. I love that too. I was just like, how did they get the pterodactyls? Okay, great. I believe they could. I believe they could too, but I would have liked to see.

SPEAKER_03 58:38

I love it. Just reminds me when Wolverine's flying one in the original series. He he he's riding one with Kazar. Yeah. Does this flying chicken have leather seat belts or something? Stupid line. Um so uh madness is ensuing. We talked about there's like a teleport sword fight, which is great. Uh it ends with Nightcrawler beating Exodus in a sword fight, and uh but then Creed, like, first of all, there's two things about this. He straight up murders Exodus, which is insane. That's I I refuse to believe it.

SPEAKER_04 59:11

I refuse to believe that that's how Exodus goes out. Like, we saw him on the ground and then they cut away. I'm gonna assume Exodus healed after that, because what the actual fuck.

SPEAKER_03 59:21

We're healing so many characters in Eczema 97 in general. Like, it's almost like every episode someone dies. Uh also, this is the first instance in this history of the show where the uh someone's standard laser pistol actually hurts somebody. So it's like or kill somebody, maybe.

SPEAKER_04 59:40

I mean, that's that's Creed's mutant power. He actually can hit someone with a gun in the X first.

SPEAKER_03 59:46

Right, because in the X-Men unit um anime universe, everyone's they don't have guns with bullets. That everyone has a laser rifle or pistol of some kind, and they're never like people you can be shot by them and just walk it off.

SPEAKER_01 59:58

It's like they're always set to stun for some reason.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:01

Right. Um, except for I guess except for like cable's gun, which like explodes things. Um maybe bishops too. Okay. So uh Exodus is dead, rest in peace, Exodus. Uh, and then at that moment, like Creed he grabs Nightcrawler, he's about to shoot him in the head. He's like, get me out of here, you freak, or I'll kill you. And then Polaris tries to kill Creed by throwing a sword at him, and Nightcrawler teleports them both to like the middle of Antarctica somewhere because it's nearby. And he gives this really cool speech about like, should I kill you or let you live? And this was pretty awesome, I thought. Yes, this was an amazing monologue by Nightcrawler.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:43

It makes up for his previous, I don't know. Well, so here's the thing like I feel like the personification of Nightcrawler in this episode is peak. Like, this is who he is, and I think it comes through, and we don't it is that uncomfortable space of like we see you wanting to do the right thing, but like ultimately your argument isn't that it's the right thing, it's that it's not your place to judge. But and like I guess this always comes down to that ethics slash almost faith question of like whose responsibility is it to take care of these threats? Um because Creed is a threat. Threed running Creed running for presidency is a threat. I was just like, I hoped he'd freeze to death or we'd get some ambiguity, and then they straight up were just like, nope, we found him. I was like, of course, fucking X Factor comes and finds Victor Creed.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:33

Did did Nightcrawler leave him to die? I think he assumed that someone would find him, and or is he gonna tell, like, did he tell X Factor?

SPEAKER_01 1:01:41

That was like part of I think that was part of um like the conclusion he came to where he was like, it's up to God or whoever to to decide, so let them decide. And he peaced out of there.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:55

Well, I mean, that's pretty. I mean, it's similar to like it reminds me of Christian Bale and Batman begins. He he's like, I don't have to say I don't have to kill you. I'm not gonna kill you, but I'm not gonna save you. He says that to Rachelle Goul at the end. But you did kill him. I don't know. Like, I find that like I'm glad you absolved yourself, Batman, of murder, but you did murder this guy. Um I don't I don't know. I think in my head cannon here, I think Nightcrawler told somebody where he was. He told the Xavier's like, I left him in the snow. Like, go do with what you will thought that information.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:30

I also had the delightful thought, I was like, what was X Factor going to do if they showed up and that like power dampener was still on? Their plane would have crashed, they would have probably died. Because, like, who do they have a flyer right now? I don't think they do.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:45

They all have to land on strong guy's body. They'd all but his he'd be depowered, so I don't know like uh much that would serve him. I mean, yeah. Uh good question. Um I'm sad about X Factor being such losers because I really like the way Havoc's powers look.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:06

I will I will say his powers look great.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:08

Um did they draw them well in this show? Like I just thought the powers looked like shit in the movies, the hypothetically uh CGI'd in the movies.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:18

Did they I know I think at some point did Gene have does Scott know that Havoc is his brother yet in the in the cartoon? I don't remember if that's known. Gene knows.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:32

Gene knows, like she pinged it at some point. And and uh what's his name? Uh Kosair. I think he like he talks to Cyclops in an episode where he explains what happened to his family, but it's not uh the neither of them know that Alex is the brother of Cyclops. They're both like there's like one missing piece of the puzzle there. So it actually has uh the only other clue we get is when Cyclops and Havoc are fighting each other in the original series.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:00

Their powers don't work on each other, and like they don't they never question it. They're like, Well, it's just the thing about being immune.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:06

Well, they no, they do they're they they're like what's good, what gives? That that's that's the kind of moment they have. So you know, I get I it's a I wonder if they'll go. I don't know. I mean, are they gonna do anything with Havoc? They he's just kind of like a nothing character so far in this show.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:21

Well, I think I think they're depicting Havoc pretty Havoc-like. Like he he's just always gonna be that person who's just like, well, you know, we're gonna we're gonna we're gonna help the humans do this, and like then they'll respect us. If our if our politics are clean enough, they'll respect us.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:39

Um I mean I'd like to see I mean Havoc was an X-Men at various times. Um I'd like I could see them doing like an interesting Cyclops Havoc episode where maybe he just joins the X-Factors disbanded, he joins the X-Men and they butt heads at first because they're both like alpha dudes, and then they realize their brothers. I don't know, I could see it like being interesting, but you're right. Like in general, Havoc is like not the most interesting of characters, unfortunately. You would also think at this point Polaris would know.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:12

Why would Polaris know? Because at some point you're gonna hear the name Alex Summers and be like, oh, Scott Summers leads the other team.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:20

Yeah, but I guess in everyone's mind it's just a big coincidence they've got the same last name.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:26

Like that never Or they never use last names in X Factor, maybe because they have to like maintain the code. No, no, she's dating habit.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:34

I was like she she set up an elaborate kidnapping to go date Alex.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:43

I mean they introduced themselves to one another. Right. Okay. So Cooper is mad at Xavier. She warns him like this was shady of you. Uh Colossus is welcomed home at the X Mansion, not at X Corpse. And it's it's like presumed that he's like joining the X-Men finally. Because this has happened like multiple times in the original series where they like Wolverine's like, you joining us, Bub. And Klaus's like, sadly, I can't. You know, I've got shit to do. You're just so disappointing as a kid. You're like, can he just please be on the fucking team? But uh, I it seems like he is now. Um, and then oh, he reveals to Nightcrawler is like, oh, I actually wasn't convinced by your arguments at all, but Ileana would have been, which I don't know what kind of answer that is. That's a little also like a weird combout.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:33

Also funny, because historically, no, she would not have. Oh Yada would have chopped his head off. I agree.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:40

It was just to soften the the news.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:42

Yeah, so hopefully Colossus is in the credits next week. That'd be fun. Um, and then we get like our stinger. Uh we see this is great. I love this. I did not see any of this coming. No. Who wants you to want to like lay down what happens?

SPEAKER_04 1:06:59

Uh so cable's team shows up uh in the very same place we saw at the end of last episode. Uh the same lap, and they find Apocalypse's bot, what is seemingly Apocalypse's body, withered and dead. Uh, and they're like, What? How could this have happened? What is going on? And Jubilee picks up the Queen of Diamonds card, the charred Queen of Diamonds card. Uh, with our, you know, the classical symbol of the classic symbol of Remy LeBeau.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:35

Uh you know, first of all, I thought Apocalypse made a beautiful skeleton. I was like, he had a nice toothy grin. And also I was happy for Ploc Apocalypse that he finally got to die. Like, I feel like he's lived like a long life of misery. And I I feel on some weird level, I think he he's resting in peace. Uh that that's my first thought I had. Um, my second thought is I know this is not going to be the case. Like, they're gonna have to, like, Gambit's gonna be insane, they're gonna have to redeem him or save him somehow. I think it'd be cool if like in the next episode Gambit's just totally normal. He's like, they he brought me back to life and I killed him. Isn't that awesome? Hey guys, how's it going? Like, we're all friends. I think that would that would be very satisfying to me if he's just like it's like I took him out single-handedly. You know, this should accomplish.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:21

And I mean, if anyone could have pulled the line like that, it would definitely be Gambit. Because, like, basically, if you remember in the comic, he was just like, Yeah, I became an acolyte, but meh, I kind of didn't wanna, so I'm just gonna bugger off. And like in the in the Herald storyline, that's what they've done. The the same thing where he was just like, Yeah, I've got this power now, thank you. I'm gonna go about my life. Uh so I could see that it was I I don't know of any context for the for this at all. Like, I don't think I've ever seen anything, maybe except for like a zombie, what if, uh, where you see an apocalypse corpse. Um fun. And so I'm comp I'm I'm genuinely curious as to what they're doing. I don't believe they're gonna like kill you can't just write off apocalypse like that. Like, I that would be insane. So I'm I'm gonna say there's some time nonsense involved here, and this is a different body of apocalypse, or we're gonna use a different timeline of apocalypse or some shit like that.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:24

Um he gets a prophecy and sees he's killed and like travels from a different time. Yeah, like Thanos in uh the Avengers movies, kind of yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:33

I was thinking also some kind of body switching. His soul is in a different vessel now or something.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:38

Maybe his soul, maybe his soul's in Gambit's body. I don't know. That pisses me off.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:43

That would piss me off. I mean, because you know they're gonna save Gambit, and I just don't want to go through the whole rigmarole of like being stressed out for Gambit slash apocalypse, the you know, the the the fighting of their souls or whatever. Uh they'll set it right by the end.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:57

Don't worry.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:58

I know, but it's just like or or maybe not.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:01

Maybe that'll be the stinger for season three, but you know, it reminds me too.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:06

It's like uh they had to fire Jonathan Majors from being Kang. And coincident, like, I I think there should be a line in one of the movies where Ant-Man's like, no, I beat Kang. That's why he's no longer at the end of Ant-Man 3, which you all all you guys saw, uh, I I vanquished Kang, and that was the end of that that chapter. Uh, maybe again, I I think that would just be a funny way to finish off a pocket. Gambit just kills him off screen. Uh and they're on to some new threat, but it'll be a more, I'm sure, a more tortured teased out kind of conclusion we're gonna get here. So, but still, I don't know, shocking fun, and I like seeing X-Worce again. Uh Psylock and Archangel and Jubilee and Sunspot now being part of the team. Yeah. Uh great episode. I don't know. I don't really have much more to add to it. What are your guys' final thoughts?

SPEAKER_04 1:11:00

I I hope this is the direction. Like I said before, I think like when you even if you just demote a show creator, there needs some time to like get yourself back on the wheels. Uh get yourself get your wheels back on the track. And I'm hoping that this is like the course that they're on now, as opposed to like accidentally stumbling here and then going back into like the softer episodes that we had so far. Um because I this episode very much felt like a season one episode, whereas so far I haven't gotten that vibe this season. Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:34

Yeah, I liked some of the apocalypse stuff that they did earlier in this season, like a few episodes ago. I was into that like backstory that they were doing, but the past couple episodes haven't really grabbed me the same way. And like you said, this one is a return to form. They really like crammed it in. You got the Savage Land, you got like character team-ups that were a little unlikely, but great to see.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:55

Um, like return to something that is a little more political. I know we like just for fun debated about the Friends of Humanity, but they are real villains in the Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, fuck them. Real racist bigots that we hate. So like they're starting to um like use their social justice voice a a little bit again, which is again like a return to form from the original series.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:20

So we can make those illusions. Yeah. Uh great. I mean, uh, oh, I have a programming note. Um, the podcast will be taking a week off next week because we will be on vacation, but we what we shall return. And uh when we return, it'll be a lot of fun. Um, I think we're gonna have Feliciano back, which is great. Yay! We'll close off the last two episodes and then we'll do the big Spider-Man Zoom get together, and then we'll figure out some more fun stuff to do as we uh segue into autumn. And and then also, hey, they they season three is done. They actually released uh teaser footage of Comic-Con of season three footage. They showed some stuff. So if you want to go online and spoil yourself, you can see some things they're working on for season three. And uh another thing I'll mention from Comic-Con, they showed a better doomsday trailer, supposedly, that like actually has a story and like character arcs and things compared to the first trailer, which seemed like CGI nonsense. Feliciano, you were gonna say.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:21

Uh sorry, I just realized I don't know this the my brain just did a couple things. I don't know if we mentioned last week um the watcher.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:31

Oh, that's right. Oh, yes.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:33

Like, we like I was just like, I I I appreciate that like they're they threw that in again. Um and I just wanted to make sure that like I was just like, oh, we have oh, did we mention the watcher? We didn't mention the watcher.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:45

I guess he was watching Apocalypse Die.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:47

He was watching, he was about to watch Apocalypse die.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:50

Um yeah, he was floating over the Parthenon in Greece. Yeah. You could see him. Yeah, I I only caught that in the second viewing, and I that's why it wasn't in my notes. That's why I don't think we brought it up, unfortunately. But yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, Fleciano. Yes. Well, that's all I have for this week. Um, good night, everybody. Good night. Peace out.